The following is a cross post, so check ADKOB for comments about this. The gang there love comments more than my readers here do…
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Does the definition of “good” vary? It must.
A large portion of our conversation Wednesday night revolved around the semantics of the word “good.”
I’m starting to wonder about this myself. “Good” is such an umbrella kind of term. Be good. In what way exactly? Brushing your teeth? Using manners? Sitting on your bum in a shopping cart? Picking up all your toys? Taking “No” for an answer without replying with a temper tantrum? That seems to be a parental definition of good. Good service at a restaurant or store. Good as in law abiding. Good as in beneficial rather than detrimental. Good as in approaching perfection. Thorough, effective, adept, deserving of respect, high morals. All these can fall under Good as well.
When atheists think of “Good” what are they thinking about? I can’t answer for every atheist, but when I hear the word “Good” I think of following laws and codes at every level laws and codes are designed, from returning books on time to full stops at stop signs (I count to 5 – do you?) and that kind of thing.
I also think of all the appropriate behaviours that improve society – cooperation, sharing, patience, respect, trust. May as well toss being useful to society in there, too, either with your job, or with volunteer work on the side.
I also think of behaviours that improve humanity – which include all those society ones plus honesty, integrity, loyalty, adaptability, and forgiveness would be in there, too. Life is too short to hold grudges and regrets.
How it started was by someone reminding us that just because someone is an atheist doesn’t mean that they can’t do good. This brought our attention to Mark 10:17-18, “And as he was setting out on his journey, a man ran up and knelt before him and asked him, ‘Good Teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?’
Breaking in right here. I think it’s unfortunate that people want eternal life. Why can’t this life be cherished and fully appreciated? Why does anyone think they need eternal life? Does anyone ever ask that?
And Jesus said to him, ‘Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.’” In this passage, Jesus changes the focus from man’s work to God’s as to what is good.
I totally disagree with Jesus here, because he doesn’t define what good is beyond saying God is it. Good is God? Good is godly? Good is a perfection no human will ever dare dream of achieving and this is why Christ doesn’t want the moniker in this story?
But Jesus tells us that no one is good except God alone, so this brought up the question can an atheist [or for argument's sake a Buddhist, Muslim, etc] do “good”? In terms of civic, civil, moral, or ethical righteousness: yes. This righteousness is only valid among men though, not God. God judges on a different basis.
So what? Do we really need to care about God’s supposed level of goodness? Does it matter on a daily basis? Does God’s goodness have anything to do with how Christians act or think? Or do they define their purpose via their church, their pastor, their congregations and their prayers over the unsaved masses?
Are they really concerned over how their god might judge them? How does that explain all the Christians who do terrible things as human beings, unethical, unrighteous, uncivil acts? Won’t this god also see what wrongs were done, just as humanity will? Or will those actions not matter a sniff “because God judges on a different basis” than humanity does?
None of us are gods. None of us will ever be gods. It is my firm belief that all we should care about it the “ethical righteousness” among men and women. Men and women have to live in the world today, so goodness needs to be agreed upon as an earth term. Who cares about how the word relates to a deity? That doesn’t matter one iota. Assuming a god is the only judge of “good” is opening the floodgates for any behaviour to be deemed good, even at the expense of our society and humanity at large.
I give you what should be an insane example but isn’t even as bad as what’s in the bible:
God wills the destruction of entire cultures, whole cities razed to the ground. Must be a good godly reason to do that, right? Even if we have to guess at god’s divine purpose since it suits our politics to blame the destruction on some group we dislike.
Does that take the onus off the rest of us to offer aid after hurricanes and earthquakes and tsunamis because god willed all that destruction for some reason only known to him? Maybe it had to do with wearing socks with sandals. Maybe mixed fabrics really do get his goat up a tree. How can we know for sure? So how dare we get involved in the clean up and after-care? He might want to send another wave or aftershock and we will have saved someone who he wanted dead? How can that be good in this god’s eyes? All we should do is pray that some of them find the righteous path before it’s too late…
Does anybody think like this that would be willing to admit it? Besides people like Pat Robertson I mean? How inhuman does a person have to be to hate people that much?
I’ll have to hit the crazy parable and judgment stuff in another post. Too much of a good thing, eh?